EvilDragon Announces A Pandora Successor, The Pyra

Michael Mrozek was one of the main guys behind the original Pandora concept in 2009, and at FOSDEM (Free and Open source Software Developers’ European Meeting) yesterday he announced his own successor to the ageing machine – the Pyra. In the videos below, Michael (otherwise known as EvilDragon on the OpenPandora boards) outlines his goals for the new machine, discussing his decision for choosing another Texas Instruments SoC and playfully boasting of the OMAP5432 capabilities. The development board in the video below is running Battle Of Wesnoth at the same time as 2x PS1 emulators all whilst doing some image manipulation in The Gimp.

The full spec for the Pyra can be found on the official website, but to summarise it’ll be a dual core 1.7Ghz OMAP5432 with 2GB Ram and a 5 inch 1080p display. It’ll retain the keyboard and gaming controls that the Pandora had as well as the dual SDXC slots and the same 4200mah battery, but it’ll carry some extras such as a 3G and/or bluetooth modules as well as a HDMI output port.

Michael is keen to emphasise that Craig(ix) is not a part of the team working on the Pyra, which will come as a great relief to anybody interested in both paying for one and also receiving it. For a nice breakdown of the Pyra, as well as a list of the people involved in the project, check this post on the OpenPandora forums.

You can view Michael’s entire hour long speech from FOSDEM below. The first 15 minutes are mostly about the Pandora, and after that it’s all talk of the Pyra.

There is no release date given for Pyra, Michael states that he is understandably reluctant to commit to a timeframe, however he does say that the project is already funded up to prototype the stage and financial backing will only be needed once mass production is ready. You can follow progress of this project on the official blog.

Many thanks to Victor for sending this in.

66 Replies to “EvilDragon Announces A Pandora Successor, The Pyra”

  1. The PANDORA/Pyra is STILL the BEST portable all-in-one computing device out there.


  2. klapse:

    Am I dreaming? A handheld device running debian, with gaming controls? SOLD!

    You’re correct. This portable/gaming computer has always been able to run certain Flavors of Linux….

  3. Portable computing will ALWAYS be a viable and important option for us all/geeks I guess. Charles Doby ponders WHY the Pandora/Pyra remains a “portable” device…..like he’s struggling to explain this tech device to his 300 lb. boyfriend/girlfriend/manatee.

    He’s a dumb-ass bore that doesn’t know electronics.

    Bottomline is that GENIUSES lik
    e small computers for their own reasons….so stfu.

  4. I’m not sure why this system remains focused on being a mobile device. If I want mobile games, I’ll grab a Vita (yes, the PS Vita), a 2DS, or maybe even a mobile phone with a joystick. For the expected price, or worse case an iPhone (on contract, maybe even off contract) and an iOS 7 compatible controller. The mobile space is extremely crowded, and better options already exist. Based on the current Pandora price point, it would be competing with an NVidia Shield. The Shield wins, hands down, any day.

    I would be interested in it more if it was cheap, and was similar in concept to the Ouya. Having a Linux game console would be very interesting.

    1. With a 5 inch 1080p screen, this will be like playing games on the TurboExpress or Gameboy Micro. “I think there some text there, but I sure in the hell can’t read it!”

    2. This.

  5. Am I dreaming? A handheld device running debian, with gaming controls? SOLD!

  6. I don’t have a Pandora but simple logic points one thing out of your argument Chad. You say that they were scammed out of their money. Now isn’t it true that they could’ve had the money refunded. That refund was a choice. If it was a scam then it wouldn’t have had a refund with it.
    Ill personally stick with my Viewsonic G Tablet even though the Pandora/Pyra are interesting devices

    1. Some people do want a refund and didn’t get it.

      There were 2 “corporations” involved with Pandora, ED’s and Craig’s. ED’s still exists. Craig’s declared bankruptcy and defaulted on his preorders. ED is using some of his own money, pandora profits, and donations to fund the remaining preorders.

      I don’t know why ED is doing that at all, because Craig has not given ED a list of names and addresses of the remaining customers. Allegedly, ED ships the Pandora to an address provided by Craig, who then resells them on eBay. ED is an idiot for not saying “GIVE ME THE FULL LIST OF REMAINING OWED PREORDERS!”

      1. From what I understand, he does have the list now, but it is much longer than Craig ever said. All there is to do now is chip away at it as much as possible, and hope to begin recouping investments with the Pyra.

        Once all the Pandoras are sold or donated to, I would hope we can continue donating to get refunds to those who have asked.

      2. I very much doubt this even happened. As far as I am aware, through communications with their corporation, I was “sent” a pandora through the mail after having ordered one long, long ago. After months of waiting: nothing. Then I tried emailing them again, and was told I was “sent” a “replacement” one for the mishap. Guess what? Nothing. Nada. Zilch. Never received the pandora, nor did I ever hear from them again. Took my money and ran. I don’t give a shit if they declared bankruptcy, I demanded a refund or at least the pandora I had been promised. There was no error in shipping, as the address was confirmed. It was never shipped to begin with.

  7. Even if ED never did anything dishonest, he still was an idiot for partnering with Craig, and it reflects poorly on him.

    I’m still looking for a portable Android keyboard, one that would be usable on the subway.

    I’d like to see another, more open, handheld become competitive with Android and iPhone. It isn’t going to be Pandora/Pyra.

    After seeing Pandora/GCW/iControlpad2, I don’t think I’m ever going to fund hardware via preorders, but I might order from stock for something cool.

    Also, Moore’s law is important. If hardware is current when designed but delivered years late, then it’s worth much less. The Pandora is pretty lame hardware compared to current stuff, and a reason to avoid it. By the time Pyra gets shipped, it’s probably going to have obsolete specs also. The GCW Zero is more than a year late, making its hardware not as interesting compared to newer devices.

    1. Moore’s law. Going off of that, A56 and A53 ARM chips are next in line but we won’t see those chips available For 2 years let alone mass produced in another. A15 so far will be the standard for a while since its been able to satisfy any type of demand. Considering how powerful the single A8 was its already scary what can a dual core A15 do.


  8. Chad W. Smith:

    “Abusing others”? “Hate and vitriol”?
    I’m the one who was called a “jackass” a “Creep” a “jerk” a “fool”.
    On the other hand, I have said that *decisions* were stupid – not people. It is dumb to do X.
    I have called Craig a liar and a thief. He is both. By the literal definition of the words. That’s not an opinion. It is a fact.

    I said you were being a creep (and according to you it’s okay to comment on what someone is doing or being so long as you don’t say what they are, right?) because you’re in a thread telling people that that enjoyed a device they purchased did something stupid – that definitely seems like creepy behavior to me. I called you a jackass because you insinuated that I’m defending Pandora because I received a free one for being buddies with Craig, when I neither received a free one nor have ever been friends with him – that’s both insulting and wrong, I think “jackass” is highly fitting. Sorry I didn’t say “being a jackass”, guess I slipped up there. I said you were banned from the forums for being a jerk, sorry but I think anyone who reads your threads from back then would agree with that – fortunately I just said you were being a jerk here so I’m in the clear, whew!

    Not so much with you when you said this though:

    “Congratulations on successfully profiting from the misfortune of others, jerk.”

    What should I call you here, a hypocrite or a liar, for saying it’s just other people using those words on you? Although twisting what he said into an accusation of profiting off of the misfortune of others somehow sounds a lot worse than calling him a jerk, I guess your game is that you can say whatever things about people so long as you don’t call them names.

  9. And in the meantime, I have been repeatedly directly personally attacked, and yet, I’m the “hater”.

    *rolls eyes*

    I’m done following this thread.

    1. Won’t miss you.

  10. Nothing any of you can say will make me:
    a) Buy a Pandora
    b) Preorder a Pyra (or ANYTHING remotely related to Pandora)
    c) Buy a Pyra once it is out
    d) Give ANY money (other than the aforementioned dollar) to ANYONE associated with Pandora
    e) Endorse Pandora (publicly or privately)
    f) Endorse Pyra (publicly or privately)
    g) Endorse anyone or anything associated with Pandora (publicly or privately)
    h) Support anyone’s decision to do any of the above

    I can’t change people’s minds, either. At least not ones so entrenched in their pre-Pandora beliefs as you all seem to be. (This feels so much like that idiotic forum, I can’t stand it.)

    But if I can warn ONE person, then I will.

    1. *pro-Pandora not pre-Pandora

      And before anyone chimes in, I said I won’t support anyone’s decision to do those things, that doesn’t mean I think I need to approve of other people’s choices for me to believe they have the right to make them. But if someone says “Hey Chad, I just bought a Pandora! Isn’t that cool?” I would say “No, that is not cool. That is not cool at all.”

      1. Chad, I don’t think anyone has a problem with your lack of trust. Everyone saw the Openpandora project unfold. If you think it went exactly as you predicted, good for you. You can get satisfaction out of that.

        The level of vitriol you bring to the table is absolutely unnecessary. It always was. Right or not, abusing others will cause your voice to be ignored.

        Be respectful and lose some of the hate. Just because things didn’t go the way you wanted last time (even though you called it) doesn’t mean they can’t go better now. Despite what you may think, things have gotten immeasurably better since you last checked in. ED has, amazingly, taken a terrible situation and moved it into a direction that the community can have faith in again.

        There were a lot of negatives in the past, but if you follow the story more closely, you’d see how hard everyone has worked to right the wrongs and continue pursuing the project’s ideal.

        1. “Abusing others”? “Hate and vitriol”?

          I’m the one who was called a “jackass” a “Creep” a “jerk” a “fool”.

          On the other hand, I have said that *decisions* were stupid – not people. It is dumb to do X.

          I have called Craig a liar and a thief. He is both. By the literal definition of the words. That’s not an opinion. It is a fact.

          1. PackageEdge says:

            So you are saying there is zero correlation between a person’s actions and their true self? When you repeatedly criticize someone’s actions/decisions in a disrespectful or condescending manner, they will eventually take that as an attack on them as a person and their ideals. Unfortunately that would cause the majority of people to react negatively.

            Do you have friends? Do you repeatedly say that core decisions of their pet projects are “dumb”? Has no one else ever asked you to be more constructive in how you interact with them?

            I would be surprised if this is the first time anyone has asked you to respect their opinion rather than attempting to crush them with yours.

          2. Fight, fight, fight, kiss, kiss, kiss.

          3. Only true Internet people can argue about why their opinion is better than the someone else’s.

          4. There’s petty internet arguing (which I also love to engage in day and night :P) and there’s stuff that really needs to be said. Chad W. Smith wants to hurt EvilDragon’s efforts and this console by spreading a bunch of FUD about it. If he isn’t exposed to be totally biased and poorly informed people might take him seriously. This is a niche device intending sell in the thousands, smear campaigns from relative nobodies can still register a negative impact.

          5. There’s nothing better than some petty Internet arguing to cheer me up when I’m feeling down. It’s the one of the reasons the internet exists, other than boobs and cats, I guess.


  11. Chad W. Smith:

    Congratulations on successfully profiting from the misfortune of others, jerk.
    I was banned long before Craig was – I was banned for reminding people of all of his lies. I warned people not to buy it, and I was removed. It is ironic as hell that the person I was warning them about got removed for doing exactly what I was removed for warning them about.
    I wasn’t offered a hand for help – because I didn’t need it. Because I wasn’t stupid enough to trust him.

    Craig was banned for the same reason you were banned, and really the same reason I’ve ever seen anyone banned on that forum (which didn’t happen often) – for treating other people like crap. It had nothing whatsoever to do with Pandora sales; at the time Pandoras were steadily if slowly being shipped to the queue and no one would have had reason to believe that there’d be big problems for later units due to issues with the nubs, assembly house, and LED cables. The banning was a questionable decision by a stressed out mod, who resigned shortly afterwards. There had already been growing fighting on the forums between the GPH console people and the Pandora people and the former wanted the others to move to another forum, which this obviously spurred.

    This is really why you shouldn’t comment on things that are based on nothing more than your assumptions.


  12. Chad W. Smith:

    It *was* millions – only SOME of that was paid back, slowly, over years. With a product that – like all tech devices loses value over time. So, despite someone actually getting the device they paid for – if they got it years later, they would have lost money.
    If I preordered an iPhone (1G) in 2006, but didn’t get it until 2009 – then I LOST MONEY because the tech that was in a iPhone 1G was outdated and replaced several times over in those years.
    So even the people who got their Pandoras years after they paid for them WERE ROBBED. So that money is still a part of a crime.

    this is bull. You can objectively determine value in the marketplace. Used CC pandoras are still going for somewhere around 300 dollar.

  13. Heh, I say people who don’t own a Pandora but make stupid comments about it that it’s outdated based on its specs are fools! I suggest you go and buy one, use it for a while, then come back here and trash it all you want, but don’t trash it before you see it it real life. It’s the best device a smart user would ever own 😛

    1. Yeah, I’ll get right on that. I’ll go spend $500 on outdated tech just so I can say the tech is outdated.

      I don’t have to buy a piece of crap to know it’s a piece of crap.

      Maybe you have to touch fire to know it’s hot, but I’m smarter than that.

      1. People spend way more money for a phone these days and what do they get? A locked down device that you pay an arm and leg for? And then you have to go and get an extra bluetooth keyboard and an extra controller just to type and play game kind of properly. You would have to illegally hack around them. You basically don’t own them. Where’s your freedom with those devices? Yeah, they may have the best SoC in the world but so what? Do you use every bit of it? The Pandora is a different. It’s open. Do whatever you want with it. Yes, it’s SoC is outdated compared to today’s standard, but it runs almost anything throw at it – all the retro games all the way up to PS1 perfectly. I can even run many PSP and Dreamcast games at playable speed! And it’s DSP potential hasn’t been tapped into yet!

        Stop hating and head over to Pandora forum and join us. We’re a good bunch of people and always welcome you Chad! 🙂

  14. Chad… the person who robbed you and so many others (myself included) was Craigix. ED has refused to do any more projects with him… Craig owes ED a huge amount of money that unfortunately ED will never see. On top of that, ED has donated his own personal funds (as well as have quite a few community members) to try and get Pandoras to Craig’s customers after Craig abandoned them. Your anger is rightly directed at Craig, but please don’t assume ED had anything to do with that whole sorry story. He’s the only reason the project was able to survive at all.

    And believe me, if Craig had anything to do with the Pyra I wouldn’t touch it and would also be warning people away… but he isnt. ED is a great guy, he’s had our backs through all this and we support and trust him absolutely. Just head on over to the Open Pandora forums and you can find out all the details of everything that went down.

    But appart from that, it doesn’t seem the Pyra is the device for you… for many of us we would choose it over any octacore android tablet or phone… I’ll let others explain why…

  15. Some people mentioned bluetooth keyboards for Android? Any good recommendations? I’m looking for something that fits in my pocket, and ideally clips on the phone. (No, not iControlPad2, I’m not that stupid.) Something like the Moga controller, but with a keyboard instead of gaming controls.

  16. Luke McCarthy says: Reply

    After my previous experience I will never trust them again. Still waiting for my Pandora which I pre-ordered in 2009. I don’t expect I will ever see it, and if I ever do it will be laughably out of date.

    1. Well what you don’t understand is that the Open Pandora was a collaboration of two companies when it started Openpandora ltd (Craig UK), OpenPandora GmbH (EvilDragon Germany).. Craig is the one that robbed you, Craig was the one that wanted to wash his hands of the whole project back a few years ago leaving people with nothing.. no units, nor refunds… EvilDragon took over the main production, moved it to Germany and got things moving again. EvilDragon is allowing people who ordered from Craig to buy Pandoras at a huge discount, He also stated he is allowing people that haven’t got their unit yet to buy the Pyra at production costs. He doesn’t have to do this, he had no connection with Craig’s customers.. Not to mention Community members are donating money to pay the costs needed to deliver pandoras to people like you.. although it’s a slow process. You have options, just need to follow through.

      1. Luke McCarthy says: Reply

        I understand that, but I was never told this originally and I was never given a choice whether I would be a customer of Craig or ED. So I hold them both responsible regardless for their complete lack of professionalism and very, very poor communication.

        1. I’m sorry about your situation, man. You are right to feel that way. So much of the OpenPandora project has been a fiasco, and I felt like you until I began dealing with ED. It was amazing after working so hard to get responses from Craig’s team. I got lucky and received my first batch unit from Craig, but it had so many issues with build quality. Not so many that I didn’t love it, but enough to certainly disappoint me. After Craig dropped off the map, ED and Askarus, were immediately prepared to fix any issues I had, and responded within hours, when I spent a year trying to get a response from Craig. I was shocked. It gave me just enough confidence in them to make the 1 GHz upgrade when I sent in my unit for repair. I thought I had destroyed my original unit anyway, and the upgrade got me a brand new, faster pandora.

          The change in quality after upgrading was as drastic as dealing with ED rather than Craig. After spending the last year with my 1 GHz, I am fully on board with wherever ED takes the Pyra. The build quality is now so much better with the German factories. The community is healthy and so positive. My trust in the team running the whole outfit is worlds better. The work by the community has managed to make this thing not just my sole gaming platform, but it is now replacing my laptop. Thumb type on the go. Game around the house. Dock to my wireless keyboard and mouse, projector, and gaming controllers at home. I now hope to have the Pyra replace my phone now.

          My fiance probably hates the Pandora. I can geek out wherever I want and however I want. Tweak this, modify that. Zone out on Settlers of Catan or Zelda OoT or Sonic Adventure. Start making pixel art for the turn-based strategy/shmup hybrid game I’ll probably never actually make… sorry for going on so long… I know it is a crummy situation and definitely not the device for everyone, but it has made me insanely happy…

  17. A new UMPC! I can finally replace my Wibrain! I’m really happy to see this project moving forward. It’s refreshing to see a new Linux based handheld with a keyboard. I’ll buy one when they’re available.

  18. Yea those craptastic octocore A7s vs dualcore A15s? That’s like a seahawks vs broncos right there. Its vastly more powerful than the Pandora with just one core. Far as I’m aware this is already more advance than my galaxy s3 and I will be very interested in this. Also since parts are cheap now I doubt this will even be above 500.

    And as for the fiasco with Pandora, Evildragon stood by his stock and store through that whole mess. He made sure all of his orders were filled and even took some of Craig’s out pity. He even circumvented him so he could get supply faster. Dragon runs a business so he can do this. We already seen the gcw trickling out and that’s coming out faster than the Pandora in a year. With kick starter it wouldn’t be hard for him to amass a large lump sum for manufacturing. I have hopes for this to work.

    1. A Kickstarter campaign might be the only way they would ever get money from me. Because I would donate the bare minimum (which I think is a dollar) just so I could post comments, and I would post over and over again that no one should dare back this trainwreck.

    2. If some other company – one that was in no possible way associated with Pandora – came out with a clam-shell portable game system + portable PC thing…. It would cost less than $300, probably less than $200. I mean look at ALL OF THE OTHER SYSTEMS ON THIS BLOG. None of them cost anywhere near what that garbage Pandora cost.

      If I can buy a Nexus 7 for less, if I can buy a PS Vita for less…. If I can buy a iPad for less…

      What possible reason would I have for buying this?

      And for $500 – I could buy a Nexus 7 AND a PS Vita, and still have money left over for a Bluetooth keyboard and game controller.

      1. I think you’re getting a little confused here. This isn’t a tablet, or a android phone with game controls, or a Vita. If you want to play candy crush on your tablet this clearly isn’t for you. This is aimed at emulating retro systems that utilize a full keyboard and people who want a full blown linux computer that they can slip in their pocket. This is a low production console that’s designed to fulfill a specific need that’s not being met by anyone else in the marketplace so of course it’s going to be expensive. Hey I’d love it if a Chinese company made something like this for $200 but that’s not going to happen.

        1. Yes, Tim, because all a Vita/Tablet/or Tablet with game controls can do is play Candy Crush…. (That’s me being sarcastic.)

          Every Android system on the planet can run emulators.

          And there’s no “Full blown” anything going on here. It’s a mobile system. If it doesn’t run Android, then it’s shooting itself in the foot.

          And the keyboard is far from “Full”. It’s missing a lot of the function keys that games like to use. (Ctrl, Alt, etc.) I mean, you have to use a Fn key to get to Tab.

          Bluetooth keyboard can have all the keys you need – including the number pad if you want.

          If you want a desktop OS in your pocket. Put Ubuntu on your phone. It’s not hard. And it’s free.

          Official Ubuntu How-to

          I grok the concept the Pandora was shooting for. But they failed. In so many ways they failed. And this thing will be no different.

          Maybe in 2006-2007, when they first started developing the Pandora, it might have been a “need” – but Android has come a long way since then. There’s very little that you can do on a desktop Linux computer that you can’t on an Android tablet. A desktop computer can do it faster, and do more things at once – but this little dual core mobile device isn’t going to be any faster than an Android phone.

          But, as you pointed out in your other post, UMPCs exist. Or I should say, they did. They don’t anymore because people realized they pretty much suck. Trying to “real work” on them is a pain because everything is so small. And anything other than that can be done on a tablet or smartphone, in a much more convenient way.

          I grok and even like the concept of a pocketable “full” computer in your pocket. Heck, I have a few UMPCs myself. I don’t use them, because it is a concept that never works out like it should. This Pariah is going to crash and burn.

          The Pandora lived up to its name. It unleashed pain and misery on everyone around it. This sequel is going to follow in her footsteps.

          1. Tellemurius says:

            Ubuntu OS is not a full OS its running within the same Dalvik machine as Android is. Emulators for Android sucks cause of the Dalvik VM, alot of times your games are not in sync with the video and audio and need a beefy device to start handling n64 and psone smoothly.

          2. I’ve used (and helped develop) emulators on several Android devices, with multiple third party controller add-ons or built-in gaming controls like on JXD’s devices and I’d choose something like Pandora any day of the week. And I say this even though I make money selling emulators on Android but give them away on Pandora – I’d still recommend people get the latter if the price isn’t a problem and they’re really into emulation and console-style games, and/or desktop functionality. The only deficit is performance and Pyra will make a big difference there. Having a couple more modestly higher clocked Cortex-A15s or Krait cores won’t make a huge difference there.

            I’m sure you can hack Ubuntu onto a phone, but it’s not the same because no one’s developing software optimized for Ubuntu on phones. With Pandora we could reliably get predictable performance, low overhead access to hardware like the video scaler, reasonably low latency audio, control of the refresh rate, and so on – good luck getting all this on a random Android device. You really pay feature roulette. Pandora also has high quality audio, dual SD slots, and so on – these nice little things really add up.

            Pyra only adds to Pandora’s strengths, improving a lot in addition to the more powerful CPU cores.

            But you already know all this Chad, you’re just trolling people because you’re bitter. I don’t know why you can’t accept that people have different tastes, interests, and requirements than you and some people are willing to pay a big price premium for it. I never understood why people liked stuff like Neo Freerunner but I don’t post comments railing about how stupid it sounds. Maybe when I was a teenager, but not now.

          3. Also, going on about how Pyra will repeat all of the problems Pandora had is just unfair and probably pretty ignorant. ED saved Pandora, it’s because of his tremendous efforts that he was able to fulfill all his preorders and a lot of Craig’s, and continues to help those people screwewd by Craig today. Craig has proven beyond any real doubt that he can’t handle a hardware project, that’s because of him, not because of the type of device Pandora is (iCP2 demonstrates this). ED moved assembly to a different company and is using entirely different manufacturing companies across the board for Pyra, and he’s not going to take orders for it until it’s actually done. Yes, Craig said the same thing, but anyone could tell it was a lie, Craig has a long history of lying about these things and ED doesn’t. ED himself was even taken in by Craig’s lies.

            I have full confidence that he’ll be able to make this happen, but if for some reason he can’t he’ll know this before he starts taking preorders for it.

          4. What you call bitterness, I call righteous indignation. MILLIONS OF DOLLARS were STOLEN.

            I want to repeat that.

            MILLIONS OF DOLLARS WERE STOLEN

            And if the topic comes to my attention in any context, I will repeat that. I want people to know that MILLIONS OF DOLLARS WERE STOLEN by the people who made Pandora. And if anyone is stupid enough to ignore that and send anyone associated with that MILLION DOLLAR THEFT *more* money for the exact same damn thing, then let them. But I will warn them first.

            I warned people before the whole thing happened, and people, like you, didn’t listen then. That’s on you.

            But that won’t stop me from warning people again.

            As far as personal taste – I’ve said I see the appeal of the concept of a pocketable clamshell electronic device – and the addition of game controls is cool, too. But paying hundreds of dollars “premium” for a device that ends up being a jack of all trades, master of none, is stupid.

            People do stupid things with their money. I’ve done – and will do – stupid things with my money. It’s everyone’s right to do so. Doesn’t mean it’s not stupid.

          5. That was supposed to be a reply to Exophase.

          6. This is astonishingly ignorant, even for you Chad. EvilDragon never stole anyone’s money. There isn’t a single person who ordered a Pandora from him who didn’t receive it (or a refund if requested, although few have). You and others may insist that he’s culpible, but they’ve been legally separate all along. And Craig has nothing at all to do with this now. You’d may as well blame ED for the iCP2 disaster too while you’re at it, if that’s the approach you want to take.

            Even Craig doesn’t have anywhere close to millions of dollars in outstanding debt, only a few hundred Pandoras at most haven’t been delivered.

            Lots of people love their Pandoras, get tons of use out of it that nothing else can give them, and are very happy with their purchase. Maybe you still think that makes them stupid. I think that makes you a creep.

          7. Only a few hundred?

            Well, let’s do the math. 2 is a couple, so it would have to be at least 300, right? And the cost was, what, $330 to preorder? Well, that’s $100,000 right there ($99,000 if you multiply exactly 300 by exactly $330 – but given that the 300 is an estimate, the rule of significant figures comes into play.)

            So – after holding on their money FOR YEARS, everyone has gotten their long-delayed, outdated stuff by now – EXCEPT for the $100 Grand or so that is still unaccounted for.

            And that’s ok, I’m guessing. Because you seem to be ok with it. But, you got yours, since you were buddies with them anyway, I believe you got one of the first ones, didn’t you? Because, I mean, you are Exophase after all. So of course you would get one first.

            Did you even have to pay for yours?

            So why would you be mad? You didn’t wait for years for something that never came. You didn’t lose any money. No skin off your nose.

            But guess what? I didn’t lose money either – because I wasn’t about to hand hundreds of dollars to someone just because they said they were going to make something with absolutely no form of accountability whatsoever. And we see how doing so turned out, didn’t we?

            My first comment on here was associating your new product in any way with the Pandora was a stupid move. Maybe ED lost money. Maybe he was the White Knight to came to everyone’s rescue (Well, except for those “Few Hundred” I guess.) Maybe he is “legally separate” from Craig.

            The Pandora still is what the Pandora is – a crime. A crime for which hundreds of people – by your own words – are still owed recompense.

            And associating any product with a crime is stupid.

            I’m not Bernie Madoff – and I didn’t profit form his Ponzi Scheme, but if I came out with a money making program and called it “The Bernie Madoff Pyramid to Riches – by Chad Smith” – I would be an idiot.

          8. Yeah, $100,000. That’s millions, right? It’s not unaccounted for, it was mostly absorbed by CircuitCo ruining several hundred populated PCBs (ie, all of the components on them). And the nub developers folding while stiffing them with a huge bill to use the nubs they already paid for. Stuff like that. And no I’m not buddies with them, jackass, I’ve never been on very good terms with Craig, I was criticizing him heavily throughout the entire thing but you wouldn’t know that because you never paid attention to anything but the sound of your own typing. So yes, I did pay for my Pandora. And I paid for part of the one I got Lordus. And I paid for the one I got slaeshjag. And I paid 2000 EUR in donations to help pay for people Craig screwed over. But I guess I’m not the humanitarian like you are, screaming on forums and comments to warn people about something you know nothing about. Wanting to contribute $1 to Kickstarter to slam the project. Like you said, you didn’t even order a Pandora, but you act like you were personally screwed over. So why ARE you mad? Because you’re clearly pretty friggin mad.

            You really, really don’t get the situation with culpability. ED was a distributor for Craig when Craig was screwing things up left and right. If someone sells a product at Newegg, and it turns out that company also stiffed people when they sold through other channels. Do you blame Newegg? Because that’s what you’re doing, blaming Newegg. I guess if Newegg likes the idea and wants to make a product inspired by it that makes it even worse, right? Going to go buy a $1 product from Newegg so you can leave negative comments like a douchebag?

            Yeah, ED and the donators haven’t been able to rescue every one of Craig’s preorder victims whom he’s discarded and is trying to be rid of any responsibility of. But he has helped a lot. So yeah, you really are a giant creep for besmirching him. I guess you’re not an idiot for endorsing Bernie Madoff, but don’t worry Chad, you’re an idiot anyway.

          9. It *was* millions – only SOME of that was paid back, slowly, over years. With a product that – like all tech devices loses value over time. So, despite someone actually getting the device they paid for – if they got it years later, they would have lost money.

            If I preordered an iPhone (1G) in 2006, but didn’t get it until 2009 – then I LOST MONEY because the tech that was in a iPhone 1G was outdated and replaced several times over in those years.

            So even the people who got their Pandoras years after they paid for them WERE ROBBED. So that money is still a part of a crime.

            And, if ED is the white knight you claim he is – then the crime is even bigger, because now even the ones who got exactly what they wanted when they wanted it got it from someone else. Then Craig is still culpable for MILLIONS of dollars of theft.

            White Knight, Victim, or conspirator – I can’t say what role ED played. I was forced out of that forum EXACTLY FOR WARNING PEOPLE ABOUT THE PANDORA – so I couldn’t follow the whole sickening tale to its inevitable conclusion.

            But regardless of his role – it is a bonehead move to say “Hey you know that thing that screwed over at least hundreds, if not thousands of people? Yeah – that thing… WE GONNA MAKE ANOTHER ONE! YAY!”

          10. Tellemurius says:

            Oh this is priceless. Craig himself was driven out of the same forum your dumbass got kicked out of. Instead of whining and bitching you could have gone through the channels setup to help people acquire their devices lost in the mess. The community accepted this plan cause they had no other choice than lost investment and They still want the device. The people that asked for refunds? It was given from other members that wanted to buy the device off of the person. We gave you the helping hand but you decided to slap it away and continued your shitfest when it could have easily solved. I walked through two devices the Pandora and the GCW, both handled with extreme miscare on funding and both I have received devices.

          11. Congratulations on successfully profiting from the misfortune of others, jerk.

            I was banned long before Craig was – I was banned for reminding people of all of his lies. I warned people not to buy it, and I was removed. It is ironic as hell that the person I was warning them about got removed for doing exactly what I was removed for warning them about.

            I wasn’t offered a hand for help – because I didn’t need it. Because I wasn’t stupid enough to trust him.

          12. When I left, “the community” was still holding CraigIX up as a paragon of virtue, a brilliant designer and innovator, and the savior of the Indie Game Machine movement. And defending his every lie with the same passion I see people defending ED with on this thread now.

          13. And you were still screaming about how the device was vaporware that’d never actually come out right up until the first units were being shipped. Not everyone can be right. Your exact words are ridiculously overblown, of course. People liked what he was selling and gave him the benefit of the doubt that he’d manage it okay.

            Personally I was always publicly critical of Craig taking money for something that was nowhere near as ready as he said it was (from the start in 2008 when he first did it), and for not being clear that he needed the money to proceed with manufacturing. Personally I didn’t pre-order one until just a couple months before they started shipping. And I said before, the more people are willing to be patient with him, the angrier they’ll be in the end. Not you though, you’ve been frothing at the mouth first thing for some reason.

          14. Tellemurius says:

            Misfortune? The fact that someone was gladly to take my money and take their spot in line while they run away trouble-free? I was in high school while this shit was going down and was able to convince my father to purchase some device he never seen in his life but instead it was spent saving some dude who was stuck in that hole. I had to pay off his pre-order and then i went to ED to extradite a device so actually I PAID MORE to receive what i wanted. Seems stupid as hell but arguing about it wasn’t going anywhere, ED make sure i got my pandora plus gave me discounts on parts shipped to me when i needed to do repairs. Sure, the dude never received his device, instead i took their obligation and instead of bitching at Craig i went straight to ED to get one to me and paid more. Obviously Craig wasn’t going to do favors and ED was giving a chance for anyone that still wanted one.

          15. “It *was* millions – only SOME of that was paid back, slowly, over years. With a product that – like all tech devices loses value over time. So, despite someone actually getting the device they paid for – if they got it years later, they would have lost money.

            If I preordered an iPhone (1G) in 2006, but didn’t get it until 2009 – then I LOST MONEY because the tech that was in a iPhone 1G was outdated and replaced several times over in those years.

            So even the people who got their Pandoras years after they paid for them WERE ROBBED. So that money is still a part of a crime.”

            Value is based on what people are willing to pay, not some intrinsic law about tech components. Pandora maintained its value because the comparative lack in power vs other devices didn’t offset the features that

            The whole thing is moot anyway, if people didn’t want to wait for their Pandora anymore for whatever reason they could have requested a refund. Most people didn’t. For both Craig and ED it would have eventually become preferable had they opted for this because for a while it was cheaper to give the money back than make new Pandoras, because they weren’t priced well. Only a little over a year ago, long after production and availability issues had been sorted, had Craig started having a bunch of problems with inability to provide refunds, except for the strange claims where he was giving money back to people who were returning their Pandoras for any reason whatsoever. And he made things worse by selling a bunch of 1GHz units for $700 which he assumed ED would give him for free. No one knows exactly how Craig managed the money, but at this point he wasn’t even the one making the Pandoras, and it had long since been clear to everyone that ED was not related to anything Craig was doing.

            “White Knight, Victim, or conspirator – I can’t say what role ED played. I was forced out of that forum EXACTLY FOR WARNING PEOPLE ABOUT THE PANDORA – so I couldn’t follow the whole sickening tale to its inevitable conclusion.”

            You were forced out of that forum for being a big angry, insulting troll who couldn’t resist making the same flamebait threads over and over again. It’s possible to oppose something without being banned, many people were – you were in the tiny minority – but most people would speak their opposition and leave it at that instead of press it at every possible opportunity.

            “But regardless of his role – it is a bonehead move to say “Hey you know that thing that screwed over at least hundreds, if not thousands of people? Yeah – that thing… WE GONNA MAKE ANOTHER ONE! YAY!””

            The Pandora devices itself never screwed over anyone, and are enjoyed by many people who are also very interested in making a successor. ED, unlike Craig, has proven he’s capable of managing production and support of a device like this. In addition to migrating the original Pandora design he’s also overseen an upgrade to the 1GHz units. There’s no reason to doubt that he’d be able to handle designing a new one.

            Again. This may be a niche product but there are actual people who want one. No one else is stepping up to do it. Why are you so determined to smear a guy who has shown himself over and over again to be honest, dependable, and capable, just because he at some point didn’t realize that partnering with Craig in promoting the device was a bad idea?

            You just have a really bad grudge, you hate the device because you hate the community that wants it, because they hate you for being a jerk.

      2. It’s a full blown computer that fits in your pocket with an open source computer. Thats what distinguishes it from a Vita or a Nexus 7. Its not a locked down OS or a crappy VM machine its an honest goodness Linux running natively. By all means though this is still a hobbyist’s playtoy, you still would be better off switching between the 7 and Vita but i would like one thing to fit in my pockets nowadays 😛

  19. I think “Pariah” would have been a better name.

    Associating your new device with that shame fiasco Pandora is a mistake.

    I was around from the beginning with that awful mess, and I know a lot of the people who were ROBBED by those liars.

    While I love the idea of a clamshell design mini-laptop / game system – there’s no way in the world I would ever give any of those people money.

    On top of everything else, by the time the thing ever did exist, it was woefully outdated. And I can already see that happening here. 2 GB of RAM is great, but only a dual-core CPU when Octo-Cores are on the market? And it will probably be another 3 years before this stupid thing sees the light of day anyway….

    Mega-Pass.

    1. Oh, and did I mention it will probably cost $750 – $1000, just like that piece of crap Pandora?

      1. I got my Pandora for $300, got it within two weeks, and I love it.

        1. Did you buy it used? Are you personal friends with Craig? Or maybe you just bought it recently – as in half a decade after it was developed.

          (I can’t say “released” because I’m not sure when it actually was “released” – it depends on if you mean when they took millions of dollars of people’s money, or when they shipped the “Developer units” to their close personal friends, or what.)

          1. Your running on old information. Craig is completely out of the picture he washed his hands of the Pandora over a year ago and the community is better for it.

            There is well over 5000 Pandoras in the wild now, EvilDragon has done a good job at getting production moving. I was lucky I got my first batch Pandora for the original pre-order price of $330 despite ordering from Craig, this is well below the production cost of making it.. EvilDragon had to make it more realistic.. currently you can get the top end Pandora model for 499 Euros ~$570USD

          2. ^Edit: 419 Euros which is $570USD

    2. Luke McCarthy says: Reply

      Also why did they base it on the end-of-line OMAP SoC?

      1. Who said it was end of line.. All Ti stated was they’re ending support for mobile phone use.. it will still be available for automotive, medical and other embedded solutions.

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